You Can't Save the Spider *and* the Butterfly

wadebramwilson:

brennacedria:

darthmama:

rhiannon42:

zimrathon:

maybethings:

darthmama:

fanaticality:

The Chantry teaches us that it is the hubris of men which brought the Darkspawn into our world. The mages had sought to usurp Heaven. But instead, they destroyed it. They were cast out, twisted and cursed by their own corruption. They returned as monsters, the first of the Darkspawn. They became a blight upon the lands, unstoppable and relentless. The Dwarven kingdoms were the first to fall. And from the deep roads, the Darkspawn drove at us again and again, until finally we neared annihilation…until the Grey Wardens came.

You know what I find so interesting about this story?

“The Chantry teaches us that is it the hubris of men which brought the Darkspawn into our world.”

I’m pretty sure several fans have come before me already and said something similar, but it’s “men’s hubris” that tainted heaven, yet mages get the shit end of the blame me stick in many instances.  No, sweeteness, mages just opened the door because they could.  Every man has hubris, this isn’t just a mage trait.  So if you’d marched your ass into the Golden City with them, you woulda tainted it just as badly as the next person.

It had nothing to do with magic or the fact that they were mages.  That just gave them a key, and sure, someone who has magic might be a little more prideful than your garden variety person-I mean hey, look, I just set your barn on fire for calling my cornfield worthless, yeah that’s right, I’m awesome-but honestly, that’s just a different kind of pride.  Someone can be just as pompous because they know how to fight really well, or they’re exceptionally good at some kind of trade and manage to make a good bit more profit off of it than most people.

It’s all way too reminiscent of Adam and Eve and the forbidden fruit and how women get the shit end of the blame me stick in many situations because of that.  Let me explain.  Mages held the key to entering heaven for the most part.  I’m sorry but, if you got a key to a mansion and you can just walk inside, what are you going to do?  You have a key to a mansion.  In most places I know of, having the key to something is frequently taken to be synonymous with owning it.  Now maybe that’s not true, maybe you only have the keys as a test to endurance and whatnot.  Like, if you don’t use the key, you’ll end up actually getting a mansion that’s better, and yeah.  But that’s not the point here.  The point is, you have a key.  There’s a fucking mansion.  Wanna go inside and claim your new crib?  :D

So mages waltzed into heaven like “Hey sup Maker, I’m just gonna sit on your couch and rest my feet for a second, we walked a LONG ASS way to get here.  Hey…why your walls turnin’ to shit, bro?”  I mean who the hell would enter the mansion and expect the walls to turn to shit?  As far as I know, the Chant of Light came AFTER the Darkspawn, so there was no guide for people saying “Hey dudes, you enter the house of God the Maker, and the walls are gonna need some serious febreeze and repainting.”

But now the mages have done it.  IT’S THEIR FAULT.  They had the key, they fucking opened the door, and shit all over heaven.  With Adam and Eve, it was a lie she was told that said “Eat the fruit and you’ll become godlike.”  So Eve was like “HEY!  Adam!  Get your ass over here, we’ve been played!”  She ate the fruit, he ate it too.  But because SHE was first to do it, now you have things like “The Sins of Eve” and the fact that women in history have actually been killed for trying to mitigate the pain of labor in childbirth because she was supposed to experience that pain in order to suffer for the sins that Eve had committed FIRST.

Misogyny at it’s finest folks.

Anyway, another point to this is that you know, you fucking KNOW, that if mages weren’t the only ones with a key to enter heaven, some garden variety yutz would’ve eventually said “Hey you know what, eff this, I’m goin’ in.”  No one watched the mages who entered Heaven.  I mean maybe someone said “Hey I don’t think this is a good idea, bro,” but where was everyone trying to stop them?  I mean, did anyone try to stop them?  Or was everyone just going along with it and watching what was happening all like “Heh, these bitches think they can usurp heaven.  I’m bettin’ fifty sovereigns that when they walk in, the walls are gonna turn into shit, bro.”

Just like Adam.  Where was he when Eve was being lied to and tempted by Satan?  That puts him at just as much fault as Eve (not to mention he ALSO ate the fruit), and the people who didn’t stop the mages from entering heaven are just as culpable for heaven’s state as the mages who entered it are.

I’m just sayin’!  Stop blaming the fucking mages for entering heaven, it was EVERYONE’S damned fault.  That’s all.  This came out longer than I meant for it to, so yeah, I’m gonna go eat the rest of my mashed potatoes perderders.

You may not have meant it to be long but it’s funny as hell. xD

It’s long but you should totally read it.

Tacking on a bit of info.

In Legacy, Corypheus says that the Black City was already tainted when they got there, that the Old Gods lied. Not certain if what he says is true, but it’s something to ponder along with what darthmama says.

darthmama makes an excellent point. But what always stood out to be were the first four words: “The Chantry teaches us.”

Everything we know about darkspawn and the Maker and the Golden City comes from an untrustworthy, biased source. One of the many reasons I love Legacy is because of what Corypheus says. His account directly challenges the Chantry’s teachings, and let’s face it, if anyone would know what really happened, it’d be him.

…I really need to finish that Chantry essay. Project while at the office today y/y?

Er…are you sure Corypheus challenges the Chantry teachings?  I would think he kinda reinforces it because obviously the Magisters went to the “Golden City” and became darkspawn.  Granted that doesn’t mean the Maker and his seat are what the Chantry think… *looks at her fanfic that talks of this stuff*

He doesn’t challenge the Chantry in that he says that’s not what created the darkspawn—he actually kind of validates that, just by existing. But rhiannon’s comment about him saying the City was already black when they got there is in Corypheus’ dialogue in Legacy, and it’s intrigued me ever since I first heard it.

I WANT TO KNOW MORE!

If we are having a Legacy debate, I WANT IN!! Because I have been waiting for someone to start talking Legacy so I could casually slip this request into the conversation, even thought its really nothing to do with the actual discussion right now but it is the bane of my existence. And please don’t tell me its ‘crappy writing,’ I don’t want to believe that. Okay so, after you KO Anders/Justice, what changes that lets them go on casually after that? 

Is it Vengeance surging forth, further cementing their bond, allowing Anders/Justice to push Corypheus out of his mind? Or, in that moment, was there like, a silent deal struck. Because some have argued that a piece of Larius’ dialogue at the end, about him being free, suggests that Corypheus tricked Hawke, and took Larius as a host, and maybe Vengeance helped to facilitate that?

There is so much Legacy that I want to discuss. 

Also, fuck the Chantry!

I haven’t played Legacy since the week it came out (when I ran through it with EVERY SINGLE HAWKE I HAD BACK TO BACK) so I don’t remember well enough off-hand to answer that. Remind me when I get to Act 3 in my current play through, since that’s when I put Legacy in my head canon. (Cause otherwise the “30 years ago” comments made in Legacy would make Hawke MUCH older than s/he should be IMO.)